Hi @kayscarlet I've been in touch with the Loomio team and they will be back to me with a answer to your question soon. Thanks for being patient.

As the proposal has showed, most people agreed that there is a clear and strong need to collect gender identity to validate the variety of gender identities. The comments people made with their votes also indicate that people think it is more than just validation.

@kayscarlet has specifically mentioned health services (thanks also for those other great links you posted before the proposal). What other specific examples do people have about how data about gender identity may help?

Your best opportunity to influence census content is to make a submission (this process opens on May 18th). This discussion can be a valuable tool to write a strong submission (e.g. expanding your knowledge of how the data can help, reading and referencing the research and papers other people are providing).

Welcome to @meganpledger @alisonbronwyn @johnsmart @jonathangodfrey. Looking forward to hearing more from you all.

Hi @kayscarlet. I've contacted the Loomio team. Their response was that screenreaders are compatible with Loomio, however since Loomio is still under development the usability is not as straightforward as it could be. If anyone using a screenreader needs assistance they can contact Richard, who leads Loomio's accessibility project, at rich@loomio.org.

There is data already available on the prevalence of transgender and gender diverse identities in New Zealand. See here: http://www.jahonline.org/article/S1054-139X(13)00753-2/abstract?cc=y= the issue is this data is two-three orders of magnitude different to the transgender prevalence data that was given in DSM 3 and DSM 4. The irony is if the prevalence data in the DSM manuals is used the provision made for trans surgery under the high cost treatment pool would have been sufficient to meet the need but instead of 160 transgender people in NZ the Youth 12 survey suggests the true number is in excess of 50,000. Healthcare by lottery?

I attended the Stats NZ interview wrt gender identity and part of the information provided to me for that included a proposal (from the UK I think) that looked to acquire the required information on identity (that was sensitive not just to transgender but intersex and non-binary gender identities as well). The proposed questions covered five pages.

If the diverse range of answers given for the Youth 12 survey is also considered then question or two in the census is unlikely to provide the high-quality information required by bureaucrats to justify changes in spending priorities.

The wording of the transgender questions in the Youth 12 survey may provide a shorter version (included options of 'I don't know' and 'I don't understand the question'

If the percentage of respondents who stated they were transgender or unsure of their gender identity (I don't know) is considered (4%) then there is one child in every classroom in NZ who is potentially transgender, intersex or has a non-binary gender identity. Our health system has almost no provision for their health needs, medical (endocrinology), surgery or mental health.

There is a clear need for accurate high-quality information about the prevalence of transgender, intersex and non-binary gender identities in NZ. I don't believe the census can deliver this information. What the census can deliver is to highlight the need for this information to be collected by Statistics NZ independent of the census.

@sallydellow - I agree that the census only needs to produce broad data on sexual and gender identity for the information to be useful for our communities. Once we have some concrete idea of our numbers then we can lobby for a more sophisticated investigation.
In the meantime it will have produced sufficient data to allow us to pressure government agencies and departments for change.

Thanks @SallyDellow The Youth 2012 research is very relevant as base data, http://www.hiirc.org.nz/page/41071 and http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1054139X13007532 This data also feeds into the need for service and facility delivery planning for schools @LisaAtStats . Trans* and gender nonconforming students are more vulnerable to bullying than their cisgender peers. Some support like respect and consistent use of preferred names and gender pronouns are more likely to be delivered by teachers, staff and other students if resources and training or professional development are funded and provided. Other support like gender neutral bathrooms for those who want them, or would feel safer using them, will cost money. Statistically supported data would help the Ministry of Education plan for capital work needed.
https://www.educationcounts.govt.nz/topics/bes/spotlight-on/spotlight-on-counter-bullying-pedagogies

Thanks Kay. Very relevant for us. :)

The police incident form that I saw (as an analyst) had 6 (six) different categories. Perhaps just use those to make the crime statistics analysis the same. They may be able to help with the experience they have in filling in gender questions.

This is great to get more discussion around need. Health and education have been identified. Are there other areas where this data could help?

Establishing a clear need for data that would be utilised by a wide range of decision makers is one of the critical criteria for the Content Determination Framework. This framework will be used to make final decisions on content for Census 2018.

Residential facilities may benefit from gender identity data. For example, making sure there are safe corrections facilities for appropriate housing of trans and intersex and genderqueer inmates. Government policy is changing to recognition of housing trans women inmates in corrections facilities of their identified gender but I understand this currently applies to post transitioning/ post operative trans women only. If human rights recommendations are picked up then self identification may be sufficient.

Given the high rates of sexual violence against trans women in men's prisons, better data on numbers and implications for housing are needed. Corrections policy of doubling up on cells may not be safe if a trans woman is housed with someone other than another trans woman. Housing trans women with cisgender women may be appropriate but there may also be fears of safety issues.

All inmates should have the right to safety and freedom from fear of assault in a corrections facility (or police holding cell etc). The issue of appropriate policies, facilities and training applies to people of different sexual orientation and youth also. With the Government switching to private prison providers for Corrections facilities, there will be a greater need for transparent policies and monitoring of compliance.

Showing a clear presence of people who do not clearly fit into the binary would hopefully eventually lead to wider changes -- things like public bathrooms/changing rooms, sports teams, military service, social groups like Girl Guides, sex education in schools (I know education was mentioned, but I feel like sex/health education needs a specific highlight -- especially when it comes to public knowledge about intersex conditions). These and many others are all areas which are segregated according to the binary, leaving those of us who do not fit unable to participate. These issues have varied and wide-reaching ramifications, from shutingt us out of activities that may improve our quality of life to actively traumatising or erasing us.

Statistics New Zealand has household surveys such as The General Social Survey which is a well-being survey. Would it be useful to collect data on gender identity in such a survey? In what ways would it be more or less useful than collecting data through the Census?

Additional surveys could be useful as an awareness raising reinforcement. The Social Survey and the Health Survey would be helpful in identifying trends and impacts of particular actions, e.g. the closure of Auckland District Health Board's trans health clinic. Suicide rates for trans people are only useful if gender identity is known and recorded. This may be an underestimate as people who don't have medical or social support may be less likely to openly self identify as trans.

@kayscarlet fyi, the ADHB's ASH clinic has not closed. It is still going but at this time not taking on new patients. It is still very much working and there have been some new ones taken on. However it is going through a reorgainisation and better is coming.

That said Statistic NZ data would be really helpful in this but......they dont have any as they have never collected it.
Hopefully they will.

Thanks for the update @rachealmcgonigal The news coverage said it was closing and I'm not sure if there has been public news about it continuing. That's one way to reduce demand. Good statistics would help health services plan to meet community needs.

Kia ora,

Apologies that I'm not able to read all submissions before responding myself - but kia ora to all those who have contributed to this discussion!

A key thing that prevents organisations that are supporting gender diverse communities (RainbowYOUTH, Agender, Genderbridge, OUTLine, to name but a few) is a lack of nationally representative data on the gender identity of New Zealanders.

We have some nationally representative data from the Youth '12 report - where young people where asked the question 'Are you Transgender?'. This provides some information, such as 1.2% of high school students self identify as Transgender. But does not provide a broader picture of the gender diverse community across all ages, and 'Transgender' may not be a term that all gender diverse people identify with.

Government organisations, such as DHB's, because of a lack of data around gender diverse people do not allocate funding to services for gender diverse people, and DHB's that are being progressive in attempting to provide services for gender diverse people struggle to determine the demand for the service they will receive.

In short, until we collect data around gender identity, these populations will continue to remain invisible and not receive the services and support needed.

Thanks

What topics in the Census (see sub-groups on the right, or for more detail the Preliminary View) would be of interest to break down by Gender Identity?

Thanks Kay - I agree with your suggestions. In addition such statistics could support the case for the provision of gender neutral uniforms as recently suggested by the Min Education. This would allow Trans or gender questioning students the option of exploring their gender presentation without having to fully present as the opposite gender.

Cross posted from Sexual orientation - more applicable here

Workplace productivity research shows that where people feel marginalised or bullied that their productivity is reduced. Many corporates are considering signing up to diversity programmes like the Rainbow Tick or getting a copy of the NZ Standard for Rainbow Diversity. Employers don’t just do this to be nice. They want the best outcomes for their company and this may include health and well-being of staff. More information about who New Zealanders are - as workers, customers, and students - will help ensure their needs are considered and appropriate policies adopted.

Does a workplace family picnic include same sex couples? Are same sex couples with children welcome at the local school? Will a parent who is transitioning be treated with respect at parent teacher evening? What about a transgender teacher at a parent teacher evening?

Showing there are more than straight and cisgender people in the world, and having an idea about that diversity, will help central and local government plan services, support and information. For example, LGBTIQ people are more vulnerable to being on the receiving end of violence than straight and cisgender people but the number of trained Diversity Liaison Officers in the police force is inadequate to ensure sensitive and appropriate support to LGBTIQ victims of crime. Better data about population groups may help justify additional professional development and support. Mind you, I also think the same about more women in the police force for similar reasons.

At some future time if prejudice against people of different sexual orientations and different gender identities disappears, then the questions could be reviewed. For now there is a need for information.

Loomio discussions AND the submissions close on the 30th June.

There has been some high quality discussion in this thread and I strongly encourage you to make a formal submission.

While all the discussions on Loomio will be formally assessed, your best opportunity to influence census content is to make a submission.

It's all closing today - Loomio discussions and the submissions.

So there is still time to make a formal submission or put down your last thoughts here.

Thanks for all your contributions. Gender identity has had the most comments, and I think the most personal stories (and certainly the most heated!). Thanks for sharing those stories, experiences and opinions.