Use of Trust Cloud To Confirm Community Transparency & Validate Current Admins

O oswgwhe Public Seen by 65

IMHO, there are two kinds of moles.

1.) Well meaning persons who can’t control their confusion. This type is hard to spot, and when you try to get rid of it, the full weight of “acceptable community standards” prevents you from getting rid of it. Sacramento has one of these today.

2.) Inadvertent or intentional vicious persons originating from whatever corner. These may or may not be government agents or socio-paths.

Either type succeeds by causing the group’s members to accuse each other, with the mole always appearing to somehow hold the politically correct high ground.

I'm citing the pain from last Friday's Structure WG conference call. It caused two people from Sacramento and one person from Southern California, who were on that call, to “quit”, amidst accusations against each other, and accusations from "leaders" on the call. The “mole's" manipulation made it seem that he had the high moral ground. Or that by listening to him it was best for the group.

Does the National group have someone of the first type that is intimately active with us today, causing our pain? Making us think the pain came from us!? And that he has no fault?

Or will we be plauged by one of the second type? If its just an official, trying to set us up the way people in Earth First were set up and then given stiff jail sentences, I think we will be able to spot them. On the other hand, although I am preparing our own internal and group-wise security protections, things could get dicey.

Please lay into me if the answer is no. I don’t really enjoy writing these things. :-((


Tricia Mon 16 Jun 2014 12:08PM

Is this conversation a worthwhile one to pursue. Like I said in the GA discussion, we'd never know for sure,anyway. Let's put noses to the grindstone instead of letting them get out of joint so easy.

When the going gets tough .... The tough get going!


Sally G Mon 16 Jun 2014 12:11PM

Thanks, Tricia. I do believe focussing on such as this is not productive. The most important thing is that I think we all want the gathering to succeed. There is lots of pressure and worries as the dates get closer; please let’s all stay focussed on the work that needs to be done.


Julia Clark Mon 16 Jun 2014 1:01PM

Conversations like this is when I miss being able to take the time and write a personalized article ... But for whatever reason that is not where I am at now.

Here is what I have written in the past about such topics

There are only two available, but both are very important.

The lesser one "War Is A Racket" is very important because Occupy Marines rely heavily on General Butlers plain spoken observations. The article goes deeper than just about General Butler, however.

The Main one "SIMPLE SABOTAGE FIELD MANUAL Strategic Services " does detail some social engineering strategies that may be employed by a mole.

Of course these are historical observations.

We know from the Snowden leaks reveals the training power points of how the NSA and affiliate contractors are active in saboteur actions.
It is very difficult for me to find articles at the moment because my internet is being throttled. However here is one.

Frankly, if the operation has not had assigned agents for intell gathering, but also social engineers it would be surprising.
I have an extensive study on various styles of agent covers, volunteer and paid. I find the best PoA is to look at it as an opportunity to get the person on board the Culling Corruption Campaign. Though I do realize that does not always work.

Maybe someone could pull the relevant documents from
I simply do not have the bandwidth that allows me access to such data heavy media at the moment.


NikiV Tue 17 Jun 2014 6:58AM

first define mole. me, its #MoleMedicine ... i hope there is a mole in our group. i hope there are several. the question is , for me, is that mole in solidarity with the principles of occupy as would be generally understood by anyone who was new to occupy. I googled "Occupy Principles of Solidarity" i liked them, so those are good for me. http://www.nycga.net/resources/documents/principles-of-solidarity/

the question is their threat to the root. but thankfully, most moles are very much like rabbit medicine, and if you just give them a safe place, most of us doing this kind of work for any length of time have mole medicine. mole medicine in reverse .... sigh. lots of emotions. some express it, some don't ... balancing that out with transparency and deep conversation and listening is the key to that healing that can take an infinity.


Julia Clark Tue 17 Jun 2014 1:41PM

Seems I am better off not using that fancy telephonic technology. I am thankful to not be effected by such emotional undertakings.


Poll Created Wed 18 Jun 2014 4:50AM

Use of Trust Cloud To Confirm Community Transparency & Validate Current Admins Closed Tue 1 Jul 2014 2:00AM

by Justin Wed 26 Apr 2017 9:09AM

The stakeholders who wished to signify their use of Trust Cloud did so. Great to see folks on there!

There are people running multiple accounts on Loomio & many of us are exhausted at the silliness.

It's not a mole but a fellow organizer(s) who has been gaming Occupy since it started with these tactics.

Going forward I propose all organizers to be empowered as a coordinator/admin of any platform creates a profile on https://trustcloud.com to hold this responsibility.


YES= This is a great idea, Ill make one now!
ABSTAIN= The idea is good, Ill make one if Im already an admin, otherwise.. eh
NO= The idea is not good, Im not making one
BLOCK= I'm a mole gaming OWS pls BAN Me


Results Option % of points Voters
Agree 14.3% 1 DH
Abstain 28.6% 2 T GB
Disagree 42.9% 3 BW SG C
Block 14.3% 1 O

7 of 55 people have participated (12%)


Wed 18 Jun 2014 11:24AM

Very good. We need to re-establish trust. I will do it myself anyway, even if there are telltale blocks to this sensible proposal.


Sally G
Wed 18 Jun 2014 7:55PM

I’m not familiar with the Trust Cloud; I realize that some folks have life situations or principles that make anonymity preferable. I personally do not like all the ’Net tracking/aggregating of one’s digital tracks, not that it can be avoided.


Brandi Williams
Sat 21 Jun 2014 6:33AM

The selections for participation is an example of a "loaded responses" or "setting up a defensive climate". The are more productive missions to pursue.


Thu 26 Jun 2014 12:16PM

It doesn't seem to add value here, in this small community, and seems problematic for activists who want to preserve their anonymity.

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