Laying the groundwork: Introductions

Great to see the introductions happening, there are more of us here as well who it would be great to hear from. The introductions do work really well to give context to the comments each person makes. can I encourage @hannahsalmon ,@silviazuur , @nicolegeluk ,@nikkiline ,
@dominiclane , @jaimedyhrberg ,to make their introduction.

At Vivien's request -

I'm 22, working in the Alcohol Management Project Team here at Wellington City Council. Mostly I'll be keeping track of what's being discussed, to help inform our next steps in writing the Alcohol Management Strategy and a Local Alcohol Plan (LAP).

Hi everyone - great to see so many new faces in here in the last few days :)

I moved to Wellington four years ago, mainly for the amazing music scene and really nice sense of community I felt every time I visited. I spent my first 3 years living right the centre of the city just off Cuba St. There aren't many cities in the world where you can live within walking distance of 10 live music venues and don't need a car to move your drum-kit between them (a home-made trolley is enough), so I felt pretty lucky. Alcohol has always been a pretty big part of my experience of the music scene, but I've never seen things get out of control at a gig in Wellington.

Spending lots of time late at night in the middle of the city was really interesting. I've always felt pretty safe around Cuba St, even living next to Glover Park which definitely has a bit of a tumultuous relationship with alcohol. The only place I've ever felt unsafe in the city is around Courtenay Place at weekends, especially after seeing some pretty nasty fights (for whatever reason mostly centered around Burger King - waiting for burgers makes drunk people angry apparently).

I'm living in quiet Roseneath now, but still walk through Courtenay Place fairly often, and I'd have to say that it does feel like a bit of a zombie apocalypse at times.

I'm in this group in a supportive role as a Loomio helper, so please feel free to ask me any questions at all, technical or otherwise.

The first public discussion group is going amazingly well, with productive discussion and brilliant ideas popping up all over the place - I'm really excited to see where this one goes!

Hi everybody I grew up in the suburbs of the Hutt Valley, where drinking was what you did (and obviously still do) habitually on a Friday and Saturday night. I'm 39 now and have travelled extensively and shared in many cultures socially for a long time. My partner and I have also run a cafe for 7 years in Newtown. We now live in Mt Vic and Courtney Place is our door step. It's great to be so close to the vibe of the city, that is when it's not Saturday night. It really turns into another world.

I would really like to see attitudes in young people change in regard to alcohol. It is great to be part of this collaboration with local government and the public.

Hi all - my name is Kate Walker, a 23yo Architecture grad living in Haitaitai/Evans Bay. I have been passionate about the changes to the Alcohol bylaws in and around Wellington, having been a member of SOBA (Society of Beer Advocates) for a while - (are there any current members in this discussion?) and feel that on the whole Wellingtonians do have a more progressive attitude towards alcohol than perhaps other areas in the country. I am British and until I was a teenager grew up in small villages and rural pubs - not so much drinking holes as much as community meeting places. How the community at large engage and relate to drinking culture in Wellington needs to find it's way sensibly and staightforwardly into the AMP, and I'm excited to be part of the discussion. It's an important one.

A correction to my hastily written question about the 'social cost' of alcohol-related vehicle crashes in Wellington city. The figure given for the year 2011 was $12.5 million. I'm curious how that figure was arrived at.

I believe the social cost of anything is immeasurable. The cost to WCC of repairing damage to amenities and cleaning up streets etc is measurable. The cost of call-outs for police, ambulance, fire brigade, tow-trucks & noise control etc is measurable. The cost of alcohol-related treatments & admissions to hospitals is measurable - but social cost is something else and vehicle crashes are only one aspect of the social or monetary cost of alcohol consumption in Wellington. That's why I'm curious about this figure.

Some national facts and estimated figures from the Alcohol Advisory Council:

What is meant by alcohol-related harm?
The National Alcohol Strategy 2000-2003 identifies the major types of alcohol related
harm as:
• deaths and physical health problems from alcohol-related conditions;
• alcohol dependence and other mental health problems;
• effects on unborn children;
• drink-driving fatalities and injuries;
• drownings;
• violence both within and beyond the home; and
• workplace injuries and lost productivity.

To attribute an annual cost to alcohol misuse in New Zealand is complex, as the
cost includes lost or reduced production, hospital and other treatment costs, and
the costs of policing related to alcohol use. Two key studies in the 1990s
attempted to estimate these annual costs. One study led by the University of
Otago, estimated the social costs of alcohol misuse as being between $1.5 billion
and $2.4 billion in 1991 (Devlin et al, 1996). In another study, by the Wellington
School of Medicine, the net tangible cost was estimated to be $2.9 billion in 1990
(Easton, 1997).

Hi everyone, my name is Marion and I live on the south coast and work in town. My work is supporting a national network of NGOs that provide mental health and addiction support services so I have a work and personal interest in this discussion. I grew up in the Waikato during a time when the large booze halls (but called 'taverns') where were most of our drinking occurred. Having spent many years in other countries now I realise there are other ways of doing things. I think that Wellington is right for a creative approach to alcohol management and using this type of engagement is a great start.
I agree with Lynsey there is compelling data about the impact of alcohol abuse and misuse. I find it interesting however that our first asylums were created to cope with the rate of alcoholism amongst the early settlers.

Hi there, my name is Taylor and I'm a second year student of math at Victoria, part time, living on the edge of Te Aro/Aro Valley. I feel that given my age, I feel most capable discussing issues relating to young drinking, as a part of student culture particularly, but am also very interested in some of the points you have all raised as well, such as music (gigs), location specific issues (such as Courtney Place), public abuse (as well as being subject to verbal abuse and physical threat from notably intoxicated persons often, I witness disturbing sexual abuse almost every friday and saturday night), and the morning after problems of smashed bottles, litter, and vomit. I am eager to engage in some kind of discussion, because I am often restless and unsure of what I personally could ever do about any of these issues.

Additionally, I am a big fan of what the people at Loomio are doing (and a big fan of some of the people!) and so was eager to participate as soon as I could!