Non-hacknight hack times
At our Open Mic Night, it was brought up that breakout groups need more time and space to actually hack. Tuesday hacknights are mostly used for networking, onboarding, and project management, so groups need more time to get stuff done.
Please leave your thoughts! You can optionally use the emoji format below to clarify each type of statement. One statement per reply can help people react directly. (You are totally welcome to do it free-form, too!)
LEGEND
:mag: Fact. :mag Things we all agree to be true.
:heart: Feeling. :heart: Subjective. Not disputable. Optionally supported by facts.
:bulb: Idea. :bulb: Ways forward. Ideally based on facts & feelings.
If you see a feeling statement that you agree with, please do use a :+1: :+1: reaction emoji to +1 it.
As the conversation moves forward, feel free to use the decision tools on the left. Each can be dropped into the conversation as many times as needed help arrive at the final outcome.
This process of conversation and decisions-making may go on for a few weeks or longer -- there's no rush!
Summary
- :mag: Ideas raised here are NOT necessarily the responsibility of core organizers to execute. (patcon)
- :heart: I feel that more responsibility that CTTO organizers take on, the harder it'll be to do the most important stuff well (gabe)
- :bulb: CTTO as an organization should focus on running awesome weekly inclusive hacknights with minimal admin overhead.
Patrick Connolly Fri 27 Apr 2018 3:49AM
:heart: I feel that perhaps we could provide "more work time" by encouraging groups to gather and work outside hacknights.
Patrick Connolly Fri 27 Apr 2018 3:50AM
:bulb: We could guide project leads to set up drop-in meetings outside hacknights when they feel this need.
Patrick Connolly Fri 27 Apr 2018 3:50AM
:bulb: We could encourage projects to meet in the same space on weekends.
Patrick Connolly Fri 27 Apr 2018 3:51AM
:mag: Coffee & Code is another local meetup that gather regularly to work.
Patrick Connolly Fri 27 Apr 2018 3:51AM
:mag: C&C gathers thrice weekly: Tues & Thurs afternoon, and noon Sunday
Patrick Connolly Fri 27 Apr 2018 3:51AM
:mag: C&C meets in specific location on each day of week.
Patrick Connolly Fri 27 Apr 2018 3:52AM
:heart: I feel that C&C gathers for social coding, mostly for the sake of learning itself.
Patrick Connolly Fri 27 Apr 2018 3:53AM
:heart: I feel that C&C is a more technical community than ours.
Patrick Connolly Fri 27 Apr 2018 3:54AM
:heart: I feel that our communities could benefit from more overlap.
Patrick Connolly Fri 27 Apr 2018 3:54AM
:bulb: We could partner with other "work time" meetups, and encourage community members to use those spaces.
Patrick Connolly Fri 27 Apr 2018 3:55AM
Re: MORE HACK TIME AT HACKNIGHTS
Patrick Connolly Fri 27 Apr 2018 3:55AM
:mag: Several long-running projects have independently come to feel they need more work time.
Patrick Connolly Fri 27 Apr 2018 3:55AM
:mag: Hacknight turn-outs are significantly smaller without designated speakers.
Patrick Connolly Fri 27 Apr 2018 3:56AM
:heart: I feel that projects rely on speakers to bring in new contributors.
Patrick Connolly Fri 27 Apr 2018 3:56AM
:bulb: We could aspire to offer clear process and space during talk, for eager project members to get right to work.
Patrick Connolly Fri 27 Apr 2018 3:57AM
:heart: I feel that only a select few people would choose to work during the intro/presentation.
Patrick Connolly Fri 27 Apr 2018 3:57AM
:heart: I feel that participating in introductions is always important.
Patrick Connolly Fri 27 Apr 2018 4:04AM
:bulb: Find venue sponsors who can provide work space for us outside of hacknights -- @sharon48
Patrick Connolly Fri 27 Apr 2018 4:05AM
:bulb: Book meeting space at CSI outside of hacknights for work time -- @sharon48
Patrick Connolly Fri 27 Apr 2018 4:06AM
:mag: CSI costs money to rent -- @sharon48
Patrick Connolly Fri 27 Apr 2018 4:06AM
:bulb: Shorten the introductions/announcements/etc, all the stuff that's not the presentation -- @sharon48
Patrick Connolly Fri 27 Apr 2018 4:07AM
:bulb: Have some hacknights with no speaker -- @sharon48
Patrick Connolly Fri 27 Apr 2018 4:07AM
:bulb: Pick a coffee shop and invite people to meet/work there (like what the Coffee & Code meetup does) -- @sharon48
Patrick Connolly Fri 27 Apr 2018 4:16AM
:mag: DemocracyKit and TOmesh started meeting regularly outside hacknights, but would still come to hacknights [to find new contributors?]
Patrick Connolly Wed 2 May 2018 7:43PM
- :mag: g0v.tw runs a full-day hackathon approx every 10 weeks.
- :mag: g0v.tw hackathons (aka jothons) end with demos.
- :mag: g0v.tw hackathons livestream at least the pitches and demos.
- :mag: Each g0v.tw hackathon has a hackfoldr (hackpad)
- :mag: hackfoldr is a tool that the g0v community built for organizing information.
- :mag: g0v.tw members have built a tool called OneButton to do all the work to kickstart a hackathon with one click.
- :mag: g0v.tw community hosts "infrathons" to help make running their events and community simpler.
- :mag: All Mandarin event resources can be translated to English in Chrome browser by right-clicking page and choosing "Translate to English"
- Hackpad pages require a bit of extra effort: For https://g0v.hackpad.tw/XXXXXXXXX, go to https://g0v.hackpad.tw/ep/pad/static/XXXXXXXXX. This page will be translatable.
Patrick Connolly Sat 5 May 2018 2:44AM
:bulb: Lets book HackLab for a Saturday once every 8 weeks or so, and invite people for a full-day shoestring civic hackathon, with recorded pitches and demos :)
Poll Created Sat 5 May 2018 2:48AM
I see a need for more work time beyond what's currently available Closed Mon 14 May 2018 4:01PM
This can be either that you need more time yourself, or that you see how others need more time. (This doesn't need to be during hacknight itself!)
EDIT: Any extra work-time doesn't necessarily need to be organized by core organizers.
Results
| Results | Option | % of points | Voters | |
|---|---|---|---|---|
|
|
Agree | 69.2% | 9 |
|
| Abstain | 7.7% | 1 |
|
|
| Disagree | 23.1% | 3 |
|
|
| Block | 0.0% | 0 | ||
| Undecided | 0% | 9 |
|
13 of 22 people have participated (59%)
Gabe
Sat 5 May 2018 6:03PM
I see Civic Tech Toronto's role as creating a space for hacknights (including work) on Tuesday evenings. If project teams need work time besides Tuesdays (and it makes perfect sense that they would!) there are lots of ways for them to self-organize.
Chris Cowperthwaite
Sun 6 May 2018 5:36PM
If groups need time beyond the weekly meetup, think it makes sense for them to organize it themselves. Once a week seems sustainable.
Patrick Connolly
Wed 9 May 2018 7:13PM
I see a need, but in light of Gabe's comments, not necessarily committed to it being the organizers' role to make it happen :)
Invited user (marjoriecastro.ca)
Thu 10 May 2018 5:41PM
Tuesdays are great to catch up on the weeks tasks and goals. An extra day would help with group activities that need more than 2hrs.
David Cox
Thu 10 May 2018 7:04PM
I agree that Civic Tech should support projects in finding space to work beyond the Tuesday night hacknights, however we do that.
Sorry about the delay in commenting, I couldn't figure out how to log in on my phone (using a desktop now).
Zaid Khan
Thu 10 May 2018 8:01PM
I'm just adding commentary. I agree with the statement (need more time), but disagree with the proposal (not on organizers to manage), mostly echoing comments of others. Tuesday = consistent connection. Other days = groups self organize.
Zaid Khan
Thu 10 May 2018 8:02PM
I'm just adding commentary. I agree with the statement (need more time), but disagree with the proposal (not on organizers to manage), mostly echoing comments of others. Tuesday = consistent connection. Other days = groups to self organize.
Zaid Khan
Thu 10 May 2018 8:03PM
I'm just adding commentary. I agree with the statement and also agree that it's not on organizers to manage. Mostly echoing comments of others. Tuesday = consistent connection. Other days = groups to self organize.
Jake Miller
Fri 11 May 2018 4:00AM
Observations:
- Tuesdays allow collaboration/consensus.
- Thursdays allow dedicated work.
- We are much more productive at City Hall vs. coffeeshops.
Opinion:
- Finding sponsor spaces on a monthly basis isn't feasible/stable. Need a different model..
Sonal Ranjit
Sun 13 May 2018 5:42PM
I agree with more work time, but agreeing with others about it's shouldn't be on the organizers to facilitate this outside of Tuesdays. I believe if there is enough interest amongst the project, they will self organize to find time extra time to work
Mohammed
Mon 14 May 2018 3:43AM
It would be great if we could have one night per month dedicated to working on projects only. In addition to that, having a spot where you can meet after work on weekends with reliable internet (and coffee) is extremely helpful
Patrick Connolly Wed 9 May 2018 8:35PM
Bringing over @gabe2's awesome thoughtful comments from Slack (for posterity in case this gets revisited in future)
Paraphrased into statements and added here as replies. (Tried to do minimal paraphrasing while breaking it down, but pls call me out if anything feels off, Gabe :) )
Patrick Connolly Wed 9 May 2018 8:45PM
- :heart: I feel that more responsibility that CTTO organizers take on, the harder it'll be to do the most important stuff well
Patrick Connolly Wed 9 May 2018 8:45PM
- :heart: I feel that hacknight organizers are already feeling stretched
Patrick Connolly Wed 9 May 2018 8:46PM
- :mag: the basic weekly hacknight roles are sometimes hard to fill
Patrick Connolly Wed 9 May 2018 8:46PM
- :heart: I feel that running more events could make current challenges worse.
Patrick Connolly Wed 9 May 2018 8:46PM
- :heart: I feel that it shouldn't be the role of hacknight organizers to make more work time.
Patrick Connolly Wed 9 May 2018 8:47PM
- :bulb: project teams should continue to do the awesome work of organizing their own work-time outside hacknights.
Patrick Connolly Wed 9 May 2018 8:47PM
:mag: Every project has different availability: dates, times and locations.
Patrick Connolly Wed 9 May 2018 8:47PM
- :heart: I feel that it would be difficult to offer extra work time/space that didn't appear to be supporting some groups more than others.
Patrick Connolly Wed 9 May 2018 8:47PM
- :heart: I feel that volunteer burnout would increase if the core organizers were to take on more responsibility.
Patrick Connolly Wed 9 May 2018 8:47PM
- :heart: I feel that more organizer burnout would risk the whole hacknight model.
Patrick Connolly Wed 9 May 2018 8:48PM
- :heart: I feel that running hacknights support the creation of more civic tech projects.
Patrick Connolly Wed 9 May 2018 8:48PM
- :bulb: CTTO as an organization should focus on running awesome weekly inclusive hacknights with minimal admin overhead.
Patrick Connolly Wed 9 May 2018 8:48PM
- :bulb: One or more people, if they want, could make space available for project team work, separate from core organizing work.
Patrick Connolly Wed 9 May 2018 9:03PM
Really vibing on @gabe2's comments, so thanks!
- :heart: I feel it's possible for organizers to facilitate or initiate a conversation (like with this Loomio thread) without accepting the responsibility to shoulder the work burden.
- :heart: I feel that the above distinction (about facilitating vs doing) was not surfaced in this thread until @gabe2 called it to attention.
- :heart: I feel that organizers could draw better lines around what their responsibilities are.
- :bulb: Let's treat hacknights as a thin platform on which all projects and initiatives run.
- :bulb: Let's reimagine "core hacknight organizing" as a really scoped and small project running on the hacknight platform itself.
- :bulb: To reinforce that, let's start pitching "core hacknight organizing" as a project pitch.
- :bulb: Let's include in that thin scope, the support of other initiatives among membership that might be "organizing-like" (like perhaps organizing full hack-days every few months)
Patrick Connolly Wed 9 May 2018 11:45PM
- :heart: I feel that creating new initiatives helps create a sense of ownership.
- :heart: I feel that supporting "organizing-like" initiatives by community members (separate from core hacknight roles) could be a way to create ownership among new folks.
Patrick Connolly Thu 10 May 2018 4:57PM
We've got a majority, but no clear consensus.
Was really informative to get perspective of @chriscowperthwaite, so I've invited BikeShare, Women and Color, and Shelter Map reps to contribute thoughts (who all organize their own hack times too).
Going to re-open the proposal for 2 days to provide time for additional input from project perspectives :)
Patrick Connolly Wed 30 May 2018 6:06PM
Ganesh and I created a doc detailing some great ways to work outside hacknights:
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1f7rNOs_kjxCWDUZuDAXvZrI4v0Xfc-cOzVTT8BtLaqk/edit#
We added it to the toolkit for pitchers: http://toolkit.civictech.ca/#f=Pitching
Patrick Connolly · Fri 27 Apr 2018 3:48AM
:bulb: We could host regular hackdays (on weekend?) at HackLab.