old Off-topic discussions (closed April 2018)

@wendyalcock Hallo Wendy, you wrote - in the main thread -
_ I made a 100% white, 100% wholemeal and 50/50 (this is the taste I prefer when I use wheat). I found the white to be a bit dull tasting, the 50/50 to be ok and the wholemeal to be really tasty (more than wheat and with a softer structure to the loaf). The 100% wholemeal spelt loaf therefore appeals to me from a nutritional point of view _

I have been making quite a lot of Spelt bread, using sourdough starter. I have found it works quite well with about 85% wholemeal Spelt with 15% wholemeal rye, and as it is a little bitter, in the mix I add a spoonful of treacle. @edna commented to me that spelt bread needs / benefits from less kneading. I think that is also generally true of other 100% wholemeal breads.

Hi Grahame - thanks for the tip, I shall try that with the flour I have left. I'd planned to attempt a sourdough with it, so I'll chuck in a bit of rye too and see what happens.

That's interesting about the kneading time. My river cottage bread recipe book says "Spelt dough just needs to be treated properly. I reckon there are two secrets: a little more kneading than normal - an extra 5 minutes or so; and proving in baskets to hold the loaves up (or make small loaves if you do not have any baskets)."

I went with around 12 mins kneading per loaf and don't have baskets so made them slightly smaller than I normally would, with the extra becoming rolls.

the reasoning behind kneading wholemeal less (this from Dan Leppard) is thiis, and it makes sense from my experience too; to achieve those big holes in a sourdough, it just seems to require 50% or more white flour in the mix..
So Dan Lepard writes..(in _ Handmade Bread _)

• _ Because as a percentage wholewheat flours contain less gluten, _ you need to handle the dough less and give it a shorter initial rise. __ Be gentle with the kneading, as the bran will tear the gluten if the dough is subjected to a rigorous and extended mixing __

I wonder if you will find that true? ..it is rather a trouble to make two simultaneous batches, kneaded differently but perhaps if you have time...

I sometimes try two different loaves at the same time to see the difference in result, so I shall aim to do this. One small issue is that I have used up my wholemeal spelt making some cinnamon and honey cookies - so I shall have to go out and buy more :)

@johnanthonyallan I think most people will be bread eaters like you rather than makers, Tony, which is why I am keen to grow a grain to make bread rather than oats. Now the vote has gone for companion planting though I will probably sway to wheat as our crop but I shall still have fun experimenting with spelt at home.

I am only likely to be a consumer and not a baker of spelt bread. It is to be highly recommended. It is a special product. We bought our first loaf at the weekend.

There is a crazy recipe on the Shipton Mill site
http://www.shipton-mill.com/baking/recipes/wholemeal-spelt-bread.htm
You don't need to knead at all and indeed in leaps up in the oven and is a bit like cake or soda bread. But I call it crazy because it's not quite like bread that has had time to rest, prove and be kneaded.
Wholemeal spelt can be worked just like white bread flour, you will feel the gluten forming the threads in the dough and you will feel when it's had enough gentle kneading. You're trying to fold in air into the dough rather than pummel it down. It becomes smooth, shiny and bouncy and doesn't stick to the work surface. That's when it goes well... I have done three batches and my recipe, and views on kneading, come from Richard Bertinet's Crust book.

Yes, that's a great book - and some copies came with a cd so you can see his rather unusual slap and fold method.

Hello everybody! How much do you all know about the work being done at The Land Institute in the US?

I see they're doing some interesting work on perennializing major crops to be planted as domestic prairies. I've read a bit on their Kernza perennial grain; an alternative to annuals which supposedly helps address soil erosion, groundwater depletion, fertilizer runoff, etc.

I'm just curious to get people's opinions on this movement.

@johncherry Would Kernza or a similar perennial grain be something you'd be interested in growing in the future? Have you heard much about it or similar projects doing the same?

3 April 2017
@johnanthonyallan You wrote
_ 0170403 Would it be possible to show automatically the date that a message is posted on this string? Or should we - GRAHAME - enter a date of origin ourselves? _

I think it is a good idea occasionally to put a date..loomio automatically and unchangeably puts comments in chronological order, with a note eg __ 5 days ago __. If there are a few entered dates, then that can help people orient themselves in the string.

So, for example, I have started this reply with today's date..

15th April 2017
Hi all, I hope you are enjoying the Easter weekend. Such fab news about the spelt seed!! Matthew and I made some fresh pasta for dinner last night using a 50/50 ratio of wholemeal spelt flour and 00 fine grade flour and it was delicious! Great texture and flavour, it worked very well. We served it with a slow cooked beef ragu 😊 Attached is a photo of it before it was cooked.