Kia ora, talofa, hello, and welcome to the Census 2018 discussion on Sexual Orientation. Statistics New Zealand wants to know what people think, so here’s your chance to have your say. I am really looking forward to hearing from you on this topic.

I am also facilitating the discussions on gender identity and sex.

I think that sexual orientation gets excluded enough everything. Surveys, research, campaigns, healthcare etc. Our communities constantly feel like they are never represented or included. I think the kind of statistics that the census could get about our communities would be super helpful in helping us working to get included in everything else. Though I also acknowledge that a lot of people will probably see it as unnecessary to state who they are attracted to, which is fine too.

Welcome @kabelmanga1 and thanks for starting the discussion. Have you got specific examples of how having census data could help?

Looking at the stats from the Youth 2000 series, those stats are used and talked about a lot within the Queer support sector. They are super useful when talking about the specific issues faced my queer youth. However those stats are just youth numbers. I think statistics around queer whanau would be amazing for example. You ask questions around education, myself and a lot of my queer friends left high school because of harassment, how many others didn't finish school? So many workplaces and schools will refuse to create inclusive policies claiming "we dont have those people here" statistics would prove otherwise I think and in an ideal world, help to make moves towards workplaces and schools and health services etc actually acknowledging us and not treating us like less. Ideally. :)

The flow-on effects for this are actually more significant than you might think. I do work with organisations on representation of underrepresented groups in traditionally cis-het dominated industries. It's hard to have discussions because we lack accurate data on the representation in the industry as this data is never collected - we can talk about women in STEM, but we can't talk about LGBTQI representation without people demanding numbers. Help us to help other people. Collect the data that is needed.

There is growing support in Government for evidence based decision making. Without statistical evidence how can government services be planned adequately? This is particularly important in relation to gender diverse people especially for health related services but also for people of diverse sexual orientations. Others have talked of bullying and exclusion. When government agencies and others assume that everyone is straight (and cisgender) that has an impact on decisions and planning for future services.

If we lived in a world without prejudice and violence this might be less important but for current realities we need better information. For example, what percentage of housing for homeless youth is LGBTIQ friendly? In Auckland the majority of housing providers for homeless youths are faithbased organisations who are not perceived as LGBTIQ supportive. If New Zealand is like the USA, then between 25% to 40% of homeless youth are LGBTIQ. How well are they supported by the current options? Better population data on seual orientation and gender identity may help ground decision making for real needs.

Welcome @nat1 and @kayscarlet. Thank you both for providing examples of how data on sexual orientation would be used.

Yes, very happy for sexual orientation data to be collected. Just wonder, though, whether some of this data may be compromised by reluctance to reply correctly - ie if an adolescent didn't want their parents to know?

I agree with guy - statistics for adolescents will most likely be compromised - however, this happens anyway, in particular with the smoking questions.
At the same time, I don't know whether youth should be included anyway, as a large amount of them don't have a definitive answer until they are an adult.
For these reasons I think sexual orientation should be included for people over 18. It would provide valuable insight which could be useful to other countries and to us for providing suitable amounts of support, consolidating ideas about equal marriage rights, and would even help businesses ie. Gay bars to know where their clientele would lie. I think it is definitely worth asking.

There is no sexuality question in the New Zealand (NZ) Census.

I believe there is a substantial population of non-heterosexual (gay, bisexual, lesbian) people in NZ. Why don’t we, as a country, know? It seems to me to be erroneous to collect statistics on other human-constitution realities like gender, age, and race, but not sexuality. This leaves us ignorant at best, and discriminatory at worst.

The Census is run and administered by Statistics New Zealand (www.census.govt.nz, www.stats.govt.nz), which states that Census information is used by businesses, iwi (Maori tribes), councils, and the government to make decisions that affect us all. The statistics collected are used to determine how government funding is spent on services in the community, and to allow councils, community groups and businesses to plan for the future.

The slogan for the 2013 NZ Census was “You count – Mā Tātou”... Except non-heterosexual folk, it seems.

Anecdotally, 5% of NZ is non-heterosexual. It could be as low at 1% or as high as 15% in some areas. But we just don’t know. If I were to use the 5% figure, that would equate to about 223,000 non-heterosexual individuals in NZ. For comparison, that’s about 23,000 more than the population of our capital, Wellington City.

The non-heterosexual community is a distinct group that has different needs, characteristics and wants to those of the general population – just like how men, or Chinese people, or 18 year-olds are different from the general population. It’s just a fact. I don’t believe the needs, characteristics and wants of non-heterosexuals are adequately funded, resourced, studied, or understood. This leads to problems.

Non-heterosexuals and their families have different health needs – think of their higher rate of: sexually transmissible infections; mental health problems including depression, anxiety, suicide/suicidal thoughts; alcohol and drug abuse. And often, non-heterosexuals will not receive medical care tailored to them because society and the medical profession is hetero-normative.

Non-heterosexuals have different reproductive and family needs – think of what it takes for a non-heterosexual couple to have a child, and raise it as a legally recognised family.

Non-heterosexuals have concerns and needs around equality, discrimination, and policy – think of the recent gay marriage Bill, gay adoption, social isolation or being singled out, next-of-kin problems, fear of persecution, bullying, whether or not to be 'out' at work, hate crimes/speech/actions, and rejection by family and friends.

Non-heterosexuals also need their own social environments, e.g. different community/sports/support/youth groups, bars or clubs, entertainment and cultural identity events (e.g. the Pride Festival, the Out Takes gay film festival, Rainbow Sports Weekend). This allows them to interact with each other, meet friends and partners, have fun, exercise, learn, grow, and help others in a supportive, non-threatening environment. I do not believe we have enough of these, and I am certain there is a complete lack of them in many parts of the country. The ones that do exist could certainly benefit from more support and funding.

Non-heterosexuals have different needs in old-age. They are more vulnerable to inappropriate standards of living because they are more likely to be single, childless, and lack other family to support them. They might suffer because of isolation and loneliness, and may be discriminated against or abused in rest-homes by ‘carers’. There is going to be an increasing number of ‘out’ non-heterosexuals reaching retirement age and old-age (thanks to the more-accepting society we are beginning to develop) – to plan for this, we need statistics that we currently do not have.

The first census to ask about sexuality would undoubtedly be one of discovery. But it is not just about a question in isolation. Its strength would come from it being paired and analysed against every other question in the census. For example, it would show not only how many non-heterosexuals there are, but where they live, their socio-economic status, and what type of family units they live in. We need to know about people to allocate funding and resources, to plan for the future, and to contribute to benchmarking around the world. Furthermore, it would indeed feed in to the very psychology of non-heterosexuals themselves.

There is another important application, again with global applications – academia. Within (and without) academic circles, there is sparse data on the proportion of non-heterosexual people in populations. Anthropologically, this is negligent. The very idea of a ‘queer bloc’ is even disputed by some. Any data that does exist is anecdotal, observational, unreliable, or incomplete. Proper data is essential for reliable studies in non-heterosexual theory, which can flow into any other area of study or research.

There was a question in the 2013 Census about same-sex ‘civilly united’ couples or same-sex de-facto couples. This is essentially a question about 'marital status'. It does not allow us to extrapolate the non-heterosexual population. Let us not forget, too, that: civil unions have only been extant since 2005; the question fails to capture bisexual people who are in opposite-sex couples; and that it also only refers couples who live in the same house.

So, what would a sexuality Census question look like? It’s not going to be ‘Are you gay, yes or no’. It could probably look something like this:

Do you identify as:
•Heterosexual
•Homosexual
•Bisexual
•Asexual
•Don't know
•Other, _____________
•Object to answering this question (similar wording appears in the religion question)

I believe that the Census is the right vehicle because a separate survey would be more confrontational, expensive, and would not be commissioned for the entire population.

Statistics New Zealand has expressed concern that homophobia and immaturity may cause answers to a sexuality question to be skewed, however I believe that erroneous responses would be easily identifiable and omitted. Such responses occur in other questions too, such as religion.

The biggest concern, I believe, is that some non-straight people do not want to be counted, or do not see the point of being counted. This is because: They think that non-straights are the same as straights and object to the distinction; They are conspiracy theorists complaining about 'invasion of privacy'. These arguments could be applied to any question in the Census. These people are selfish, and don't care about the greater good for gay people in NZ and overseas.

The other reason for not wanting to respond to the question is being closeted. They fear that they will be outed amongst the millions in a national survey, and persecuted for it. This is just not likely.

“In any case, it would still be extremely valuable to know the population of 'out' or freely self-identifying non-straights.”

Springtail says anyone can make a submission to Statistics NZ to include a sexuality question in the next Census, in 2018.

“They plan very far in advance, so don’t dilly dally.”