Should we rename group admins?
I'm soo tired of seeing the term admin around loomio.
It's used in 2 ways: managing the loomio system (accepting new group requests etc), as well as having special privileges in groups.
So I want to suggest we use another term for the latter purpose of facilitating discussions and managing groups - Keeping admin for the system sense.
I see most other communities use the term Mod, short for moderator. So I will suggest we use that. I would like to suggest the term facilitator too..
ANYTHING but admin. please. Your thoughts?
Richard D. Bartlett Thu 25 Apr 2013 3:38AM
I'm not against this suggestion at all, I just don't quite understand the problem, or what benefit you expect would come from splitting the role in two.
Matthew Bartlett Thu 25 Apr 2013 3:56AM
I agree having two different sorts of admin is a bit confusing. 'Moderator' is okay. 'Mod' too techie, I think.
Robert Guthrie Thu 25 Apr 2013 4:13AM
@richarddbartlett it's already split in two. Group Admins and (yuck) super admins I'm just trying to get clarity around what people mean when they say admin. Moderator is what is used in some other online communities.
Richard D. Bartlett Thu 25 Apr 2013 4:34AM
@robertguthrie oh I see! Sorry I misread you, which is a case in point for why we should have two words for the two roles.
For the purposes of this conversation I'd suggest we refer to Group Admins and Super Admins, and figure out a better alternative for one or both of them.
I'm not saying 'admin' is the best word for the Group Admin, but I do feel they perform a more administrative function than a moderating one. 'Moderating' can refer to restricting people's expression, which I don't think Group Admins are doing.
Robert Guthrie Thu 25 Apr 2013 4:57AM
Thing is, its the group admins who can delete content, remove people, invite people etc.. Sounds like Moderating to me.
Given a few hours to settle I'm kinda ok with Group Admin.
iacocoba Thu 25 Apr 2013 7:42AM
@richarddbartlett we need multiple option vote... in Agora Voting we are going to star using VUT ! Enjoy! http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Single_transferable_vote
Richard D. Bartlett Thu 25 Apr 2013 12:22PM
@yagoabati I disagree that we need a poll to answer this question. I don't think we want to identify the most popular option, we want to identify the best option.
iacocoba Thu 25 Apr 2013 6:47PM
So @richarddbartlett you dont think the most popular option is the best? And how can we know wich is the best?
Robert Guthrie Fri 26 Apr 2013 12:53AM
Today, I'm pretty happy with the user facing term Admin. Why was my opinion so different yesterday?
Alanna Irving Fri 26 Apr 2013 1:22AM
@yagoabati you really believe that most popular = best? Think about how that works in the real world. I have a feeling you have many experiences where the popular opinion really isn't the best one. By forcing people to wrestle with the options, not just having a poll, as you can see people's thinking evolves. See what happened to Rob's opinion? That's the beauty of Loomio.
Personally I prefer "facilitator" for the group admin role, and admin for the Loomio admin role.
Richard D. Bartlett Fri 26 Apr 2013 2:16AM
I think currently our Group Admins are doing mostly administration and a little bit of facilitation. They are the only users that can perform administrative functions, so it makes sense to identify them on that basis.
I don't feel good about calling them Facilitators or Moderators, because anyone in the group can facilitate or moderate.
We want to encourage facilitation to be as widely distributed as possible, so I think it could be quite problematic to label a couple of people Facilitator, because the inference is that the rest of us are Not Facilitators.
Potentially in the future we will want to identify a Facilitator for particular discussions, but I don't think it is a role that needs to be named yet.
@robertguthrie if we called the Super Admins 'mechanics' or 'gorillas' or 'execs' or anything, and left Group Admins as they are, would that feel better?
iacocoba Fri 26 Apr 2013 10:05AM
@alannakrause i didn't mean I believe that. I think the most popular=best when you have a significant sample of people. This sample of people have to be informed and connected with reality. If you create a Loomio group you have to add people in order to make everything work in this direction.
iacocoba Fri 26 Apr 2013 10:16AM
@richarddbartlett This is the ideal situation. @alannakrause Obviously you will never have this ideal situation. In this case i wondering if is better to have a liquid feedback so people who are more informed and better prepared could have a delegation over them so they have extra votes.
Danyl Strype Mon 29 Apr 2013 12:24PM
I think @robertguthrie has raised a good point around the confusion created for the Loomio team. Important to remember though that only the term for Group Admin is a user-facing term. It should be a term that has the same meaning in Loomio as it would in a face-to-face meeting. I agree with @richarddbartlett that the actual mechanics of the role is more administrator than moderator or facilitator. Perhaps "engineer" could replace admin for Super Admins (this phrase makes me cringe too ;)
Poll Created Wed 15 May 2013 12:11AM
Rename group admin to "Group Coordinator" Closed Sat 18 May 2013 12:16AM
|Results||Option||% of points||Voters|
|Undecided||0%||882||SW G DB DMA KS KA|
19 of 901 people have voted (2%)
Richard D. Bartlett
Wed 15 May 2013 12:13AM
Admin, facilitator, moderator... all these words have connotations that don't quite fit the role. Talking about a 'coordinator' feels more neutral and accurate to me.
Wed 15 May 2013 12:59AM
No really happy about a 2 word label - but the meaning is captured well. I wonder if we're worrying too much about the meaning when we just want a simple term people already understand. The double use of admin is not user visible so not a big prob
Robert Guthrie Wed 15 May 2013 1:05AM
Maybe we should do a UX test on this. Something like "Here is a screenshot from loomio - from looking at this, which users would you contact if you wanted to suggest someone to invite, or required someone to remove a comment from a discussion" and look a the results using admin vs coordinator
Or we do what we want.. and teach the users our style/system rather than trying to meeting their expectations all the time :)
vivien maidaborn Wed 15 May 2013 3:22AM
Yeah I like coordinator by itself, can we make that change in the proposal @richarddbartlett ?
Richard D. Bartlett Wed 15 May 2013 5:03AM
Oh yeah that's what I meant. Rather than starting a new proposal, treat it as if it just says "coordinator". If that pleases you please click green!
@alannakrause @matthewbartlett @vivienmaidabornloo
vivien maidaborn · Thu 25 Apr 2013 2:44AM
I really like that, I'm a mod I'm a mod mod mod - could be a song!