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****ing censorship? Harmful Digital Communications Bill

DU Andrew McPherson Public Seen by 205

http://www.parliament.nz/en-nz/pb/legislation/bills/00DBHOH_BILL12843_1/harmful-digital-communications-bill

David:
Does censorship have to be imposed online just because someone said some mean or naughty words ?
Or should "Crusher" Collins MP **** off and read Voltaire ?
[I disapprove of what you have to say, but I will defend to the death to say it.]

Strypey:
It would be good to come up with a statement on the pros and cons of this Bill from the Pirate POV. The TechLiberty analysis might be a good starting point:
http://techliberty.org.nz/safe-harbours-in-hdc-bill-are-a-threat-to-freedom-of-expression/

Both NetSafe and Judith Collins seems to be pumping out media releases to justify this bill:
http://www.radionz.co.nz/news/national/233720/online-predators-getting-bolder
http://www.radionz.co.nz/news/national/235831/complaint-after-porn-video-goes-viral

HM

Hubat McJuhes Sun 8 Dec 2013 11:46AM

I don't think that the bill needs changing. The bill doesn't need to exist in the first place.

What we need is freedom of speech.
But as with all things: with great power (and freedom of speech is a great power) comes great responsibilities. The rights of individuals must be protected and freedom of speech has and always had its limitations. These limitations need to be clearly defined and enforced.

The above is true, independent of the media used. If you yell across the school yard or post something on the school's blackboard, if you publish an article in a newspaper or express yourself in a tv show, if you write a blog or post a comment in facebook: if you express yourself so that the public can recognise it, you re responsible for the expression. It's all the same, regardless of the media.

It may be tasteless, it may be ugly; but it is covered by the freedom of speech unless certain limits are not violated. If these limits are unclear, they must be defined more clearly, but certainly these limits again apply to all expressions regardless of the media. Why, for heavens sake, would they need to be media specific?

This is only done to react to a vague feeling of unease of many for a new media, badly understood by many. This is populism. Because as a matter of fact there is nothing special about the internet. The laws apply as with any other media. For some people it might not feel that way, but that is a misconception.

Let's try out what happens if we want to make the same kind of media specific regulations for another
transport layer of expression, one that is old-school enough to be well known by the elderlies as well. Here comes the 'Harmful graffiti Bill':

a toilet wall comment should not disclose sensitive personal facts about an individual (Principle 1);

a toilet wall comment should not be threatening, intimidating, or menacing (Principle 2);

a toilet wall comment should not be grossly offensive to a reasonable person in the complainant's position (Principle 3);

a toilet wall comment should not be indecent or obscene (Principle 4);

a toilet wall comment should not be part of a pattern of conduct that constitutes harassment (Principle 5);

a toilet wall comment should not make a false allegation (Principle 6);

a toilet wall comment should not contain a matter that is published in breach of confidence (Principle 7);

a toilet wall comment should not incite or encourage anyone to send a message to a person with the intention of causing harm to that person (Principle 8);

a toilet wall comment should not incite or encourage another person to commit suicide (Principle 9);

a toilet wall comment should not denigrate a person by reason of his or her colour, race, ethnic or national origins, religion, gender, sexual orientation, or disability (Principle 10) (Part 1, Subpart 1, Clause 6).

All of the above is very well and I can agree with all of it. It should just never have been written, even more so with the intent of making it part of a law. It's just too specific and contained.

It all makes more sense if you replace 'a toilet wall comment' with 'any public expression of opinion'. But if you do that and read again, you will immediately recognise a bad smell, don't you? It just sounds a little harsh if your gossiping in the pub is in the realm. But that is very similar to what a facebook timeline is for many, too.

It is that smell of over-protective sentiment that we respond to that is not to be applied to the same degree in general.

CM

Craig Magee Sun 8 Dec 2013 8:14PM

That's really well laid out.

Comments and publication on the Internet are different from natter in the pub and scribbles on the toilet wall though because it's persistent, exposed to a wider audience, and often can't be scrubbed off by anyone but the author.
There's a marked difference between talking about someone at the local pub with a few people and publishing on Facebook for anyone and everyone to see for years to come.

DS

Danyl Strype Sun 8 Dec 2013 11:50PM

That's why I made the comparison between internet publishing and print publishing. Anything published in a newspaper is persistent, exposed to a wider audience, and can't be scrubbed off, period. Worse, the contents of popular newspapers are generally assumed by their readers to be established fact, unlike a person's FB or Twitter feed, blog etc. Yet the powers that be have never seen the need for a Harmful Printed Communications Bill.

I agree with Hubat. If freedom of the press belongs to those who own one, and the ability to publish online gives everyone the equivalent of a press, then this bill is an attack on the freedom of the press.

CM

Craig Magee Tue 10 Dec 2013 5:15AM

DS

Poll Created Wed 5 Feb 2014 2:26AM

Make a Statement Opposing the Harmful Digital Communications Bill Closed Wed 12 Feb 2014 10:08AM

Outcome
by Danyl Strype Wed 26 Apr 2017 8:47AM

There was unanimous consensus (who says it's impossible ;) that the NZ Pirates oppose the Harmful Digital Communications Bill, because it gives the state unjustified power to police free speech and free expression.

The consensus seems to be that we just don't think the Bill is necessary. We would reject a Harmful Print Communications Bill as an attack on freedom of the press, and this is the same principle. If there are components of the Bill which are necessary, they should be made as amendments to the appropriate laws on libel, slander, stalking etc. These would be the key messages of a press release giving our position on this bill.

Results

Results Option % of points Voters
Agree 100.0% 9 DS AR DU TF TJ DP HM BK RU
Abstain 0.0% 0  
Disagree 0.0% 0  
Block 0.0% 0  
Undecided 0% 11 AJ KT CM BV M PA AB DU RF CW MD

9 of 20 people have participated (45%)

DS

Danyl Strype
Agree
Wed 5 Feb 2014 2:29AM

Maybe also make a reference to the TechLiberty analysis and any other relevant critique.

DP

David Peterson
Agree
Wed 5 Feb 2014 7:04AM

We should allow these limits on our free speech to happen, they're intrusions in our privacy and restrictions on the internet.

HM

Hubat McJuhes
Agree
Fri 7 Feb 2014 8:53AM

The bill is Participation -1, so opposing this is good :-)

DU

Andrew McPherson
Agree
Sat 8 Feb 2014 6:20PM

The only part of the bill I am in favour of is criminalising the incitement to suicide, however there should be an exemption for politicians. I would not wish to ban people from telling an MP that they should stop ruining the country, die already...

DP

David Peterson
Agree
Tue 11 Feb 2014 11:30AM

We shouldn't allow these limits on our free speech to happen, they're intrusions in our privacy and restrictions on the internet.

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