Mz Topics
Roy Brooks PublicSeen by 55A thread to enable people to propose/discuss ideas for topics to focus on at the event
how can we lower the barriers to sharing work within the network?
What does good employment look like? e.g. min/max pay? contracts vs freelance? etc.
How we're failing to meet our obligations as co-ops.
Outlandish struggles in a number of areas - the majority of our workers aren't members (people have to work for a year first due to past complications), we have more men called Matt than we have women, we find it hard to find time to do the things that actually matter to us most.
"obligations"? "struggles"? Sounds like you Outlandish types are really down on yourselves :-) You've only been a co-op for a little while, and co-operation is a process, a journey to be enjoyed. No rush.
From @harryrobbins : (Consider how to) 'educate each other about products, services and markets and use the resources of network to give and get qualified introductions to third parties who may be a source of new business'
Think we could explore a co-op angle on this which is neither inter-trading nor referral (nor education) but using co-op structure to mediate collaboration - @graham2 and I coined the phrase 'multiplex co-op'. Relates to thinking around Ronald Coase and the boundary of the firm - reducing the transaction cost of collaboration between tech firms.
So, (how to) 'reduce the costs of negotiating contracts' within the 'zord? (excuse the 'Coase for Dummies' take)
Yes essentially - except that the 'contract' notion itself is in question. Reduce the cost of /reduce the time required for - making transactions for the exchange of work/value - while maintaining trust.
' - while maintaining trust' ... and, where the product is commercial, 'responsibility'. Indeed a challenging topic
From me: supporting and developing integrated open source tools for "transparent, democratic, and decentralized organizing"
Establishing a non-poaching policy! This kind of ties in with what Sion said a while back about principle 6 and collaboration not competition.
@roybrooks would you be able to record these topics to make sure nothing slips through?
Yup, (for now, using this thread to collate...)
Thanks!
How can co-ops become less dependent on corporations?
Many co-ops depend on corporations for things like:
- Hosting (eg Amazon)
- Software (non Free, eg Windows or OSX)
- Services (Slack, GitHub etc)
- Hardware (There might not be an answer to this in the short term)
To what extent can these things be provided co-cooperatively and what can we do to move in that direction?
When working together how can we ensure that principle 6, Co-operation among Co-operatives is balanced with principle 4, Autonomy and Independence?
Linked principles: achieving independence and autonomy for the coop will depend on a high level of mutual aid (intercooperation) between coop members. Coop Tech is in itself a Principle Six initiative. It need not impinge on the autonomy of members if we have a membership framework that sets out clearly a good balance between the benefits that come with membership and the responsibilities/commitments required of members. Suggest this membership agreement is the core document for the project.
Sounds like agreeing a clear membership framework including these considerations is a great idea. How would we ensure that a sufficient cross-section of people participate in putting together this framework, so that the consensus on it is durable as well as functional?
Webarchitects has a policy that "All software artefacts that the co-operative produces to be licensed under a FSF approved license."
See the list of FSF approved licences.
What can we, collectively, do to work with, promote and help develop the Free software movement?
Whilst lots of these topics are interesting/important/valuable in their own right, I'm hopeful that this event could also be more ambitious in its reach. @sionwhellens has, on a number of occasions in the decade or two that I've been honoured to know him, made it clear that he's in the game to change the world. A sentiment that i respect and admire, and one to which I think the Megazord should aspire.
So, as well as talking about the nitty gritty of how me might better cooperate with each other, what about talking/thinking about the end that justifies these means. How could the Mz make a bigger splash?
Answers below, please.
Big splash?
Starter for 10:
'Help' (read shove) ICA etc to get their media into C21 for one thing! Two days of global conference #iscoop16 and barely a tweet let alone livestream... virtual info blackout for anyone not actually in Quebec
(Apologies, my growing bugbear with coops - focus always internal, never out.)
My 2 penn'orth on that one: ICA is an obsolete entity. I'd rather spend my time making something better than trying to patch up that particular creaking hulk.
[Sorry to be negative, but sometimes one has to say it as one sees it.]
yeah co-ops (well, not just co-ops, all sorts of good project doing important work really) do seem to generally be pretty crappy at sharing their stories. I mean, I find it ridiculous that the isn't e.g. a good nice short video introduction to say Suma Wholefoods.
Someone has suggested http://www.appgree.com/appgree/en/ as a tool for collating and voting on interesting ideas.
Anyone had any experience with it, or similar tools?
Do people think it would be ✘ or ✔ ?
I've used a similar tool called Loomio quite a bit :P (but not never actually use appgree). See also https://represent.me/ (could create a group on there to have a play too).
Thanks for that -- I think it is important to be aware of the big picture -- couldn't find a recording of that talk but there are quite a few talks by Jeremy Rifkin on YouTube which are well worth listening to.
Ta for the links. Still nothing out of the Canada event tho :(
There are videos from the 2016 summit linked from sommetinter.coop, I haven't however watched any of these.
I did however watch Paul Mason and the following discussion, he is quite interesting on the big picture, the text of his talk ends with:
"There’s other things to do; start a co-op; write an open-source App; work for free sometimes; create free stuff. That’s one part of the revolution. The important thing is: to demand the state ceases to support neoliberal solutions and actively supports collaborative business models.
If we can imagine a zero carbon future and implement it by design, we can do the same for a zero-poverty future and a zero work future too."
Ta Chris. 2016 summit vids are, sadly, mediocre, content free, 'newscasts'. The sort of thing that used to come out of political conferences in the '80s.
Paul's talk is, fortunately, the opposite!
I wonder if we should set aside the first morning just for introductions?
I have worked with some other co-ops, eg mc3 and agile but not others, and would be interested in hearing answers to questions like:
- How long your co-op has been going and how it came into existence
- What kind of work do you do
- What kind of clients do you work for
- What other co-ops do you work with and what is your relationship with them
- What services do you source from organisations which are not co-ops
- How many workers do you have and what do they do
Attached is the suggested programme from Seeds for Change.
In light of my partner's new job and the changes that it is pushing through, on my time and other aspects of family life here, I've decided that family needs to come first right now, so sadly I'm not going to be able to get along to Wortley Hall.
I would make a plea though, to those that are going be there, that whilst you may - quite rightly - focus on the core issues of how a group of cooperatives can co-operate on intertrading and related activities, that you spare some time and energy to discussion of the broader opportunity that such collaboration can enable. This network of cooperatives holds enormous power in its ability to create new tools.
We live in interesting times, with much change going on. This brings challenges but also opportunities, and a small group of people, with shared values and focus, and the right tools, can have a major and lasting impact.
In terms of the practical here and now, I'm hopeful that there is already a consensus to create some sort of consortium/coalition/network with a view to sharing information, work, skills and learning to mutual benefit. A useful framework in which that exchange can be facilitated is provided by the Viable Systems Model (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Viable_system_model) a robust and proven approach that I think would serve this network well. It also happens that one of the UK's leading experts in how this stuff works is a bloke called Jon Walker, ex-Suma Wholefoods and a keen cooperator. He lives near me, and I'm sure he will be very interested to help if that is of value.
Have a great discussion.
From the discussions - paraphrasing for focus - so far :
@harryrobbins:
1) (Create) a UK-based coalition of tech-focused co-operatives that pool their resources to achieve their shared aims – making the world better and fairer with technology
2) (Get) 3,000 people profitably employed in tech co-ops by 2020 and 100,000 by 2030
3) make it almost impossible for private companies to compete against us
@graham2
1) enable "coalition of UK-based tech-focussed cooperatives"
2) create something that is big enough and innovative enough to be able to challenge the dominant exploitative model
@roybrooks
1) How can worker co-ops collaborate better with other types of co-op and/or 'tech for good' businesses?
2) What benefits would a common/unified body offer members, other co-operators and 'clients'?
@shaunfensom
1) 'line our ducks' re 'Co-op Digital, and their ambitions to intervene in the digital-tech sector and promote growth.... & (have) a special role for co-ops on the Internet
2) draw non co-op but sympathetic/compatible tech companies into co-operative ventures eg collaborative tendering
3) collaborate on infrastructure
@kayleighwalsh
(How to create) an engaged and united community