Integration with Slack

Nice to meet everyone.

Hi ! I know this thread is old, I was wondering if a mattermost integration would be available for Loomio nowadays ? Me and my team would like to use Loomio via Mattermost

https://www.loomio.org/slack is probably the thing you want

is there documentation anywhere about the loomio slack integration? - we are planning to upgrade loomio to enable us to use this - but would like a bit of info to share with others about how this works... thanks

?? @gdpelican @robertguthrie hope you are appropriate people to tag ;-)

Thanks for the confirmation @jameskiesel and I hope the question didn't sound like an inquisition ;) I asked because I found myself about to claim, in a comment on the consultation group for the new NZ GOAL Software Edition policy, that Loomio was an example of a company that is successfully commercializing their software without using an "open core" strategy. I felt pretty certain that was the case, I just wanted to be absolutely sure I wasn't providing inaccurate information in a formal consultation.

Thanks too to @gregorycassel for your clarification. The NZOSS instance was only set up recently, so I imagine its the current version, but to be honest I've only played with it a couple of times. As I say, I haven't actually used Slack, and although I've had a look at the hompage and their pitch video, I guess I'm still not certain what this class of application does and doesn't include.

The code for the slack integration is open source and always will be, and I have spent some time recently which will allow it to communicate with any type of webhook endpoint, not just slack's.

@richarddbartlett @alanna @jonlemmon and the rest else from the Loomio team might have something to say about the above comment too. If you think this deserves its own thread, feel free to delete this comment and repost it as the context for a new thread.

Hey @matthewbartlett, I've been reading about Oracle taking MySQL, software that was previously 100% free code, and making some of its components proprietary, so they are only available in its commercial "Enterprise Edition". This is known as an "open core" strategy, and its one of the bad things that happen to free code projects that get swallowed by corporates ("acquired"). It's a way of outsourcing a certain amount of development work to the free code community, without giving back on an equal basis.

I advocate that the software made by companies that use "open core" strategies be strategically forked, and the fully free code version made better than the "Enterprise Edition" as quickly as possible. This way, software companies will learn that free code contributors are not a "human resource" they can exploit for private profit, and only companies that release all their code can benefit from the work of the free code community and survive commercially. To me, this is essential self-defence for the free code and open source movements, and a key part of the strategy against openwashing.

So, before I start lobbing rhetorical missiles at Oracle for dragging its drift nets and bottom trawlers through our communities, I just wanted to check that putting Slack integration on the paid plan doesn't mean that you are withholding the source code, or putting it under a proprietary license. I'd hate to see an inspiring, mission-driven cooperative like Loomio drinking the "open core" kool-aid.

EDIT: fixed typo

Sorry I neglected to reply before here @strypey . FWIW Rocket Chat is definitely, totally a Slack alternative in terms of features. (Dunno if the NZOSS version you used before was similar to current versions.)

I think the main questions about Rocket Chat vs. Slack are in stabililty and performance across various devices.

On a somewhat related note, super glad the Loomio webhook for Slack is open source. :)

Ae, WebRTC is a newish open protocol for semi-P2P audio/video chat, originally developed at Google. When I tried out the NZOSS instance of RocketChat, I couldn't really see anything other than a chat platform. I haven't used Slack or Mattermost, but my understanding is that they include a lot more functions than that, so I'm not sure if calling RocketChat a "Slack alternative" is any more accurate than calling meet.jit.si a "Slack alternative".

RocketChat also has integrated video chat, although I haven't tried that feature yet; and RocketChat is already available on Sandstorm.

I've done a little bit of reading about Slack, MatterMost, and RocketChat. MatterMost was designed specifically as a Slack alternative, but it seems like RocketChat is actually more like a WebRTC platform than a Slack alternative. The NZ Open Source Society have set up an instance of RocketChat if anyone wants to try it out.

Yeah but I'd say they wouldn't get very far in whatever prioritization process we end up with, because they strike me as high cost low reward at the moment. Would more likely be an open source contributor with a specific interest in using those tools with Loomio showing up and rocking it out.

@jameskiesel can we integrate with those Slackternatives?

Not addressing a specific case, just making a general point. For the record, I haven't used Slack and if I needed those functions, I would probably use a free code alternative like MatterMost or RocketChat. Do you intend to put integration with those into a paid plan as well, or only integration with proprietary apps? If it's the latter, on reflection, I actually support that.

Which apps are you thinking of, Strypey?

We're really happy to tailor arrangements to suit different groups. If you've got a group like that who're really keen to integrate with Slack but can't afford a subscription, let's talk ([email protected]) — I'm sure we can work something out :smiley:

Your choice of course, but I'm not sure if this is wise. If Loomio charges for Slack integration, and other free code decision-making apps don't, that could be reason enough for a group who use Slack a lot not to choose Loomio.

Hi Michael — we're looking at offering Slack integration on our paid plans. If you'd like to give it a try, drop me a note: [email protected] and I can set up a trial for you.

Just wanted to say this would be an awesome tool to have for Slack. Currently I find my network having conversations on Loomio rather than utilizing the core decision making aspect. A Slack add in would concentrate Loomio to it's main function, the interactive proposal piece. Can't wait to see this!

Oh dear! I'm being challenged to put my time where my typing fingers are ;) As a project coordinator rather than a developer I'm not sure how I can help, but I'll certainly keep an eye out for opportunities to integrate your work into our work on permaculture.org.nz.

EDIT: I have some other thoughts on this, and this tangent is important, but its at risk of hijacking this thread about Slack integration, so I'll post elsewhere and post a link here. A 'fork' button would be so useful right now!

Help us out here, @strypey (if you want). We're itching to work on this kind of thing.

This is a bit of a tangent, but I'm really pleased to see Slack and MatterMost using the same API. I think the web app world gain a lot from a major push for open standardization, so for example one standard API for all apps in the style of Slack/ MatterMost/ RocketChat, one API for decision-making apps like Loomio etc, one API for microblogging feeds (Twitter, GNU Social, Pump.io etc). This way a project like Loomio could implement support for one API to support a whole class of other web apps.The web is massively extensible because HTML provides such a bridge between websites and browsers, regardless of vendor on either end.

mattermost apparently has been designed to use the same api as slack so presumably it wouldn't be a huge amount more work to enable support for this? a tick box and somewhere to set config for where your mattermost server was? (would be nice for loomio to be co-supporting open source colleagues!)

Sure. We have a slack integration which is in 'beta' (ie, we're testing it internally some before deciding how to integrate it into the interface, whether it's a premium feature, etc.). The response to it has been overwhelmingly positive.

I'm currently moving the event system in Loomio from a services architecture to a pub/sub architecture, (<- technical babble), which functionally means that this feature is likely to become one of our first plugins (although I kinda don't like that word, heh.).

I don't want to spend time on a mattermost / rocketchat integration unless Loomio itself moves to one of these platforms (something we've discussed a bit internally, but hasn't really gotten traction yet), but am more than happy to support a contributor with this, and I think that once this rearchitecture is complete (ETA end-of-year), writing new integrations will be pretty easy.

RocketChat is another free (and open source) Slack alternative

@jameskiesel do you want to update about your work on this?

+1 for MatterMost.

MatterMost is a free code Slack alternative which would also be a good candidate for integration with Loomio.

It would work really well, and Loomio already has a good structure in which to add this - but someone has to be willing to do the work and core devs have L1.0 prioritised until at least April.

If Loomio doesn't already have webhook functionality, I'm afraid I don't have the time to help with that atm. You might look into adding some event-based features to the Angular app's API if this is something you'd be interested in supporting eventually.

@jameskiesel I agree that this isn't essential, but is nifty. Other than https://github.com/loomio/loomio/issues/1530 what else can we look at to determine the feasibility of this with the current Loomio API? Thanks.

Sounds like something fun to work on on a rainy day down the road.

@george2 is this something you might want to work on? I am not sure if we have webhooks... @robertguthrie @jameskiesel

If you have a Slack account, check out https://slack.com/services/new#diy and https://slack.com/services/new/incoming-webhook. (Screenshot if you don't.) Looks super easy, if Loomio has webhooks? Also, looks like https://api.slack.com/slash-commands could be used to "/vote someproposal yes" etc., directly from Slack.

+1000000 to this idea! Anyone know what's involved in making this work?

This would be cool, and probably something that could be done independently by using the Loomio API, which I've researched some but wish I knew more about.

Anyone know if it's possible to be notified from the API "[w]hen someone votes, creates a discussion or proposal..."?