COVID Mandate by Jurisdiction review- Monday 20 June at 2pm.

From Mic- Unfortunately having the meeting on Monday does not give people much notice.  That is disappointing for those who would like to be a part of the conversation.

Hi @Michaela Kennedy- this was certainly raised in yesterday's discussion at the Risk Jedi. It is an important piece of work that needs to be actioned. Anyone can join the conversation either on Monday or through Loomio.

From Renee- I am away next week unfortunately. 

From Mic-

Please correct me if I’m wrong Jason but the only other opportunity Renee has to contribute is to read through the document and links and make a comment on Loomio. 

Sorry Renee, maybe we can record the meeting if that is helpful for people.

Hi @Renee Davies and @Michaela Kennedy- if you have an opportunity to review this and provide feedback/comments on this thread, it would certainly help out. Apologies for the short timeframe.

Thanks Jason. I am unable to attend and wonder if the advice from the lawyer can be posted here for people to review and enable contribution for consideration at Monday's meeting

Thanks- there is a link in the thread- can you access the doc and make comments/questions?

I cant make next Mondays meeting, as I am with a participant for an NDIS review meeting....I think this is a somewhat grey area...whether mandates are law or not, in these times?? I understand that Mandates are implemented by government as emergency response to a crises(in this case, the spread of COVID) ...is there crises over yet (?) or has this been tested...are there precedence cases ..I am not saying , I don't agree or agree, with the mandates, what I AM saying is that, as we are not employers of support workers/care workers, where does our responsibility start and finish?

Thanks Yvonne, good question. In terms of the question about the "legality" of the mandates, if they are still applicable (i.e. is the pandemic over), and have they been tested etc this is not for this Jedlet. The Mandate Work around Jedlet are exploring these grey areas- do you have the information for that Jedlet?

In terms of this Jedlet, as an organisation we are required/mandated (what ever word you would like to use) to follow them- if we don't there is a risk to us as an organisation (of fines and other sanctions such as possible deregistration with the NDIS).

As the current mandates stand, there are implications for us as an organisation and to some of our members (as in, its not just for care workers or support workers- its much wider than that depending on what state you reside- for example in NSW it states "a person must not provide disability services unless the person is appropriately vaccinated"). We need to consider the information and implement strategies (just like we did last time).

Last time, we received advice from the lawyer, reviewed the information and developed the Win/Win Strategy and developed various resources to assist our members, participants and other workers within the sector. All of this is within the Risk Jedi Sharepoint folder.

👍

I read through the document - (which I must say looks to me to be cut and pasted from the wording of each Health directive, there doesn't seem to be any advice or imterpretation by the lawer in their own words of what the mandate means to us as an organisation)

I admit my focus was on QLD - however I cannot see where Support Coorodinators fall into the examples of a Health Care worker

‘High-risk settings’ include early childhood, primary and security educational settings, corrective service facilities, police watchhouse and some areas of airports.

There are specific directions for:

Examples of a healthcare worker include an employee or contractor of a disability accommodation service, support worker providing services in supported independent living NDIS funded psychologist or occupational therapist providing in home support for an NDIS participant’s wellbeing (whether a registered or unregistered NDIS provider), non NDIS support person that provides in home assistance to a person in residential aged care;

Please see the advice from the aged care facility that my father resides in.

To assist families, we have attached a visiting protocol flowchart for reference. This will explain visiting arrangements whether your vaccinated, unvaccinated, or visiting a loved one.

Please remember to adhere to the below:

• All visits on site or off site MUST be booked in at reception.

• Visiting hours are from 8:30am to 4:30pm 7 days. This is based on 2 people per visit for a

  maximum of 4 hours

• TGA approved Rapid Antigen Test is to be completed daily on site before visiting your loved

  one.

• NoosaCare is providing 1 free RAT kit for one visitor per resident per day i.e., there are a

  maximum of 2 visitors per resident per day, the second visitor is to bring their own TGA

  approved RAT test kit.

• Face masks remain mandatory for the duration of your visit at any Aged Care facility.

• Wash hands before entering and leaving the facility

• Stay 1.5 metres away from others where possible

• Stay away when unwell

• Follow requests from the NoosaCare staff to help keep staff and residents safe

Jeder could potentially to do a risk assessment on the above advice

COS could follow this direction and safely have face to face with our Participants.

Thanks @Julie Anne Carrington. You raise a good question- are visitors and employees/workers classified differently under the Mandate (please correct me if I am wrong in my summary/assumption)?

Its also ok to concentrate on your state (QLD)- I would not expect everyone to be all over each of the jurisdictions.

From my perspective- they are classified differently based on:

1. This Direction applies to a person who is seeking to enter and remain in a residential aged care facility as a visitor for the purpose of visiting or providing support to a resident of that residential aged care facility, or to provide products or services on a voluntary basis, as part of their role with an organisation other than the residential aged care facility.

   Note: a person who is an employee, a student undertaking placement, or a volunteer engaged directly by a residential aged care facility is not considered a visitor who is subject to the requirements of this direction but is considered either a residential aged care worker or a worker in healthcare who is required to comply with the Workers in a healthcare setting (COVID-19 Vaccination Requirements) Direction (No. 4) or its successors.

To me, if we receive payment for the supports we provide (which would be classified as a Health Care Worker- as we are certainly promoting wellbeing) we would not be classified as voluntary and as such the mandate conditions apply.

Thoughts?

I realise the differance betwwen visitors and employee's - from the CEO of the care facility

"We have been working within grey areas of the mandate to assist families to visit their loved ones".

I know there is a clear point of difference between visitors and employee’s - grey areas is my point how can we be creative working within the guidelines.  

I'm not really good at deciphering this type of jargon and agree that there doesn't seem to be any actual advice from the lawyer only copied information from the government information. From a little google search there seems to be another update as of June 17, link below. Does this make this information outdated? I am also aware that the pandemic status has been extended to September 2022 which I believe allows for such mandates. However we don't know what is going to happen after that.

https://legislation.nsw.gov.au/file/Public%20Health%20(COVID-19%20General)%20Order%20(No%202)%202022_220617.pdf

What is important to me is that we have options for those who do not wish to either get vaccinated or do not want the boosters. We have done well to date with having the option of working non face to face and as long as this can continue I would be grateful. I don't think anything is certain for the long term until the pandemic is over.

I look forward to further discussions on Monday and I will advocate for wider collaboration opportunities and simplified information share.

Thanks Mic- I will have a look at the info.

The update to the NSW Mandate includes:

Update: 15/06/2022-

Explanatory note The object of this Order is to repeal and remake the Public Health ((COVID-19 General) Order 2022 with the following amendments—

(a) the removal of the direction that persons who enter nightclubs, strip clubs, sex on premises venues and large indoor music festivals must register their contact details,

(b) the removal of the direction that only fully vaccinated persons may be on premises where a large indoor music festival is being held.

Hi, apologies for anyone that missed it, but the Jedlet Notes can be found: 2022 06 20 Mandate by Jurisdiction Jedlet .docx

Questions that were not able to be explored further at the Jedlet, so we have decided to post them on Loomio for some further discussion. Each question will be posted as an individual comment- if you could reply to the comment that would be great:

Q1. What are the risks (organisationally) if we are not meeting the mandate requirements? Any reputational, perceived or actual risks we should be considering/managing?

Couple of thoughts from me:

Reputational-

• Jeder Institute does not follow the law (mandates).

Perceived-

• Jeder Institute employs unvaccinated members.

Actual-

• if we receive a fine, this will significantly financially disrupt our organisation, and potentially lead to de-registration (due to not abiding by our conditions of not breaking any laws).

• Members that are not vaccinated continue to conduct face to face meetings with participants/families/sector. How do we know each member that is not vaccinated is complying with the mandate (i.e. not conducting face to face meetings)?

Questions that were not able to be explored further at the Jedlet, so we have decided to post them on Loomio for some further discussion. Each question will be posted as an individual comment- if you could reply to the comment that would be great:

Q2. Workshops and gatherings- what do we need to consider if we are facilitating? Link to our COVIDSafe Plan?

Questions that were not able to be explored further at the Jedlet, so we have decided to post them on Loomio for some further discussion. Each question will be posted as an individual comment- if you could reply to the comment that would be great:

Q3. Would it be possible to meet with a plan nominee, rather than a participant?

I think it would depend on what the Mandate states in each jurisdiction?

For example, in NSW a person must not provide disability services unless the person is appropriately vaccinated- the definition of disability services means services provided in person to a person with a disability including services funded or provided under the NDIS or Assisted School Transport.

Basically, for NSW NDIS members, we are still conducting business/work and charging for it using NDIS funds and that work is face to face- although not directly with a person with a disability. It would certainly be a grey area and could potentially be explored further in the Mandate Workaround Jedlet? Thoughts?

For COBU members, I don't think this would apply in NSW.

Questions that were not able to be explored further at the Jedlet, so we have decided to post them on Loomio for some further discussion. Each question will be posted as an individual comment- if you could reply to the comment that would be great:

Q4. What is the cost of the Lawyer that completed this work? Are Members paying for this?

I will get this information and posted on Loomio ASAP.